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Pirátské strany patří do vězení


V pondělní Mladé frontě (9. 1. 2012) jsem si přečetl text Benjamina Kurase, opatřený titulkem ‘Pirátské strany patří do vězení’. Přinášíme vám ho níže. Jako místopředseda Pirátů bych v několika větách chtěl podpořit a rozvinout základní autorovu myšlenku.



10. 1. 2012


Datum: 10. 1. 2012, Autor: Mikuláš Ferjenčík, Benjamin Kuras, red
Přečteno: 8568x
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Komentáře

Propaganda
(Josef Kadleček, 23. 1. 2012 - 08:09:23)
Odpovědět
To je dobrý gól ! Když si to srovnám se slovníkem bolševických, předrevolučních médií, tak ten pán by tam beze stopy zapadl.

Novináři
(jakuub, 13. 1. 2012 - 18:25:06)
Odpovědět
Je sranda, že to zrovna píše novinář. Když se podívám na naše média, tak pomalu stejné nadpisy, skoro stejné články... to je taky kopírování ne?

Podřezávání větve?
(rejpal, 13. 1. 2012 - 11:11:54)
Odpovědět
Chování všech těch institucí - OSA, RIAA, CPU a kolik jich vlastně je, zejména vyčíslování škod vzniklých piráty, mi tak trochu připomíná člověka, který sedí na vysokém topolu na větvi a pilkou odřezává větev, na které sedí. Proč? Odpověď vidím u těch, kdo stahují. Část stahuje zadarmo ze zásady a nikdy si nic nekoupí (někteří pak ještě stažené prodávají dál, ale ty není tak těžké odhalit a sankcionovat). Z nich nikdy tvůrci a vydavatelé nic mít nebudou. Další část stahuje, aby měla přehled a to, co se jí líbí, si poté koupí. A část stahuje věci, které by si koupili, kdyby bylo kde - spousta starých věcí prostě z katalogů zmizela už před lety a reedice nehrozí. Troufám si tvrdit, že mezi druhou a třetí skupinou je řada lidí, jejichž náklady na provozování svého hobby legální koupí vysoce překračují celostátní průměr. Buď chtějí originál, nebo mají jiné vnitřní důvody hudební byznys podpořit (třeba jsou fanoušky nějakého interpreta). Nechci do tohoto postu zatahovat morálku, jde mi v něm jen o čistě obchodní pohled na věc. Proč se ty instituce pouštějí do boje s lidmi, kteří patří k významným zákazníkům a nesnaží se hledat řešení, které by vyhovovalo oběma? Nestačilo by například zvýšit ochranu titulů před vydáním a nějakou dobu po něm za to, že by se neotravovali konzumenti již fruktifikovaných produktů, na nichž se už tak jako tak vydělat nedá a umožnil jim například přístup k nahrávkám třeba za mírný roční paušál (pokud možno splatný nějakým pohodlným způsobem, třeba SMS. Ta jednoduchost zaplacení má na řadu lidí motivační účinky)?

Re: Podřezávání větve?
(Kuky, 13. 1. 2012 - 17:06:16)
Odpovědět
Výrobci trestají své nejlepší zákazníky. Nejen pronásledováním, ale i ochranami proti kopírování. Navíc kdo z fanoušků stojí o speciální edici čehokoliv, která začíná nepřeskočitelnou reklamou na údajně protizákonnou činnost, včetně nejrůznějších výhrůžek? Vždyť oni to zneprodejňují sami! Koupil byste někdo salám, u kterého by bylo upozornění, že jej lze jíst pouze v soukromí potmě a ukázání salámu komukoli jinému je trestné?

A státy tuhle zhůvěřilost posvěcují.

Re: Re: Podřezávání větve?
(Pavel, 19. 1. 2012 - 11:26:30)
Odpovědět
Ta analogie se salamem je jeste slaba. S sdilenim to totiz funguje tak, ze clovek muze ti veci sehnat rychle, snadno, zadarmo a jeste v lepsi kvalite (bez reklam, bez zastaralych medii). To je pak celkem jednoducha volba. At zije volny trh, zadne monopoly!

Kdo je Benjamin Kuras
(Filip, 12. 1. 2012 - 18:48:30)
Odpovědět
http://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Kuras

Pig Pen
(Petr Vít, 12. 1. 2012 - 16:30:34)
Odpovědět
Známý blog Pig Pen Benjamina Kurase....

Kuras
(Dada, 12. 1. 2012 - 11:59:47)
Odpovědět
Kuras není ani pravicový ani levicový. Kuras je jednoše hloupý člověk.

Re: Kuras
(Josef Kadleček, 23. 1. 2012 - 08:16:08)
Odpovědět
No jo, ale konvertoval k judaismu => má za zády nejsilnější ochránce svých senilních blábolů. Tak mě napadá - jaký vztah máme my, Piráti k Tel Avivu?

Kdo krade?
(mineas, 12. 1. 2012 - 02:06:45)
Odpovědět
Bylo by hezké, kdyby peníze z hudebních CD a další tvorby šly jejich autorům. Až přestanou dostávat ubohou almužnu a zisk neshrábnou distributoři, prodejci avšechen ten marketing kolem, rád si budu kupovat originální CD a DVD. Do té doby na to nemám, jelikož jedno stojí 300 a jestli z toho na autora připadá kolem 5 korun, je to hodně (ale to asi přeceňuju) ;-(

Re: Kdo krade?
(mineas, 12. 1. 2012 - 02:09:07)
Odpovědět
Mimochodem, bylo by hezké, kdyby se podstatnáčást zisků přestala investovat do protipirátské ochrany, kódování a dalších mechanismů bránících kopírování, které někdo týden po vytvoření prolomí a pak už jde jen o vyhazování peněz z okna... ale uživí se na tom tisíce lidí, kteří nevytváření žádnou reálnou hodnotu.

Re: Kdo krade?
(Michal, 12. 1. 2012 - 13:58:08)
Odpovědět
Howgh. Presne proto piraty podporuju ja. Pokud to jde, od autoru kupuju primo, pres distributory ani korunu!!!!

vOYNcMiCVGWGLQf
(Nephi, 29. 1. 2012 - 08:13:50)
Odpovědět
Thanks for sahring. What a pleasure to read!

cVQbDxPHQar
(xroqvcwp, 29. 1. 2012 - 15:27:18)
Odpovědět
X2TQKV psfvmefvofiy

autor clanku
(Skalda, 11. 1. 2012 - 23:28:35)
Odpovědět
ten pan je jednak demagog a druhak nevi (jako vetsina lidi, ale aspon o tom nepisou), ze intelektualni vlastnictvi je v rozporu s ochranou vlastnictvi hmotneho... tudiz analogie s jidlem, saty a nabytkem je nejenze spatna, ale zcela zavadejici

Re: autor clanku
(Skalda, 11. 1. 2012 - 23:37:09)
Odpovědět
velmi trefne jsem si jako dalsi clanek po tomto vytahl z RSS ctecky tento:
http://www.mises.cz/clanky/obzaloba-dusevniho-vlastnictvi-cast-vi--520.aspx
:-)

RpBSCkKeyRNDmvyTOM
(Arry, 26. 1. 2012 - 14:35:33)
Odpovědět
The expertise shines through. Thanks for taking the time to aswner.

RLFjGuQpHWkrQTrlAv
(Rain, 26. 1. 2012 - 14:09:05)
Odpovědět
Cheers pal. I do aprepictae the writing.

tDfKDjGySWnF
(kwsaioqdp, 26. 1. 2012 - 17:30:04)
Odpovědět
HRzVVh vwgjgudrwgxm

Cože?
(j, 11. 1. 2012 - 11:23:42)
Odpovědět
To jako pan Kurasy myslí vážně? Zdá se mi, že ne, leda by teda byl naprosto mimo mísu, nebyl schopen si dohledat relevantní informace a stvořit trochu smysluplnou úvahu (což by u novináře byl poměrně zásadní problém). Další možnost je, že mu někdy někdo šlápnul na kuří oko, článek byl dobře zaplacen, no a nebo prostě jenom razí jakýsi pochybný tendenční názor, který nemá nic společného s realitou.

Re: Cože?
(motorka, 11. 1. 2012 - 15:14:20)
Odpovědět
To je tak... pán prská, protože tohle by jaksi mohlo fungovat.

Re: Cože?
(next_ghost, 11. 1. 2012 - 16:33:23)
Odpovědět
Mno, čeští novináři sice umí psát, ale ještě se nenaučili číst. Pak není divu, že vznikají podobné bláboly.

pdfEtoVAUqkf
(BertieorBirdie, 26. 1. 2012 - 20:09:28)
Odpovědět
My prolebm was a wall until I read this, then I smashed it.

pWlVIGQjhotqWpcyVAv
(yqfsjzftg, 27. 1. 2012 - 17:37:50)
Odpovědět
hhmCiZ maeqbuochmuz

Pirátské strany patří do vězení
(Kostas, 10. 1. 2012 - 22:50:03)
Odpovědět
Tak tohle mně silně připomíná komanče, když nevěděli kudy kam. Je úžasné, jak se historie opakuje a lidé se z ní nepoučí.

To chce protiútok
(motorka, 10. 1. 2012 - 22:36:12)
Odpovědět
Rohlíky ani boty přece nejde namnožit s nulovými výrobními náklady. Ten první argument (věci zadarmo) je naprosto zcestný.
I když dalo by se to zrealizovat, ale to je jiná. To by také vyžadovalo odpovědnost lidí, především jejich chamtivost (jak tehdy za prvních komunistů cpali chleba i prasatům, pak nebyla ani mouka).

Re: To chce protiútok
(motorka, 10. 1. 2012 - 22:37:05)
Odpovědět
Mám na mysli, ovládnout svou chamtivost.

Uplnej
(Kadlik, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:11:31)
Odpovědět
Pan kraus je uplne blbej nebo a to si myslim spis velmi doobre zaplacenej.

Pan Kuras je pravicový politik, že?
(Kuky, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:07:16)
Odpovědět
Někdo by mu měl vysvětlit některé základní tržní mechanismy:

1) Není-li trh schopen pokrýt nějakou oblast poptávky, pokryje ji černý trh.

2) Regulace trhu deformují ceny.

U audiovizuálních autorských děl jsme svědky fungování obou těchto mechanismů. Vydavatelé nejsou ochotni pokrýt poptávku po levné hudbě, filmech, literatuře, trh si pomohl sám a vydavatelé nejsou schopni prodávat za deformované ceny tolik, kolik by chtěli. Proto volají po dalších regulacích. Tím ovšem docílí jen dalších deformací cen a dalšího úbytku zákazníků.

Re: Pan Kuras je pravicový politik, že?
(Pavel, 10. 1. 2012 - 13:01:15)
Odpovědět
Ono to neni jenom o cenach, taky jde o dostupnosti. Kdyz si chci poslechnout nejakou hudbu, tak si ji stahnu nebo poslechnu online, protoze je to jednodussi nez vyrazit do obchodu, koupit CD a potom nekde pracne shanet neco, co mi ho prehraju (muj notebook rozhodne ne).

Re: Re: Pan Kuras je pravicový politik, že?
(Okolojdoucíí, 10. 1. 2012 - 14:27:14)
Odpovědět
Však jo - v případě, který popisujete, není vydavatel schopen/ochoten pokrýt poptávku, a proto funguje černý trh. A ta neschopnost se projevuje vysokou cenou či špatnou dostupností.

Re: Pan Kuras je pravicový politik, že?
(Jakub Koláček, 11. 1. 2012 - 21:23:58)
Odpovědět
Jen musím upozornit že o "směnu" v rámci "trhu" se jedná, pokud k ní přikročí obě strany dobrovolně. V případě kopírování se nejedná o černý ani žádný jiný trh, ale prostě o "pirátství".

Re: Re: Pan Kuras je pravicový politik, že?
(hr, 11. 1. 2012 - 23:08:28)
Odpovědět
O on stahující pirát nebo ten posílající jednají nedobrovolně? Nedostatkové zboží putuje neoficiálním (nekontrolovaným a neskásnutým) kanálem od jednoho ke druhému. Neuspokojená poptávka si přitáhne nabídku. Je to černý trh.

Článek Benjamina Kurase je hloupost.
(, 10. 1. 2012 - 10:33:35)
Odpovědět
Hudební průmysl krachuje, protože je neúměrně drahý, není ochoten slevnit a nevhodně chrání své vlastnictví. Já stahuju vyjmečně (v podstatě vůbec) a hudební CD bych si za ty peníze kolik stojí nekoupil. O DRM ochranách, reklamách před filmem a jiných otravných věcech ani nemluvím.

Re: Článek Benjamina Kurase je hloupost.
(Okolojdoucíí, 10. 1. 2012 - 11:40:01)
Odpovědět
Hudební průmysl bohužel nekrachuje, naopak jsou jeho tržby každým rokem vyšší, a to navzdory jeho řečem o tom, jak je čím dál více okrádán piráty.


(hugo dugo, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:46:18)
Odpovědět
práve toto

Re: Článek Benjamina Kurase je hloupost.
(Abbik, 10. 1. 2012 - 16:10:22)
Odpovědět
Nevypada to ze by hudebni prumysl krachoval akorat pan Kuras poukazuje na to ze krachuji mali prodejci za kterymi nikdo nestoji krachuji proto ze je drti velci prodejci aby potlacili vzestup konkurence. Bohuzel si pravdepodobne sam neuvedomuje co napsal.

Navrch nema smysl zachranovat civilizaci ktera si to nezaslouzi. A ne vsechny spolecnosti ousourcujou vyrobu v Cine, pro nektere to znamenalo takovy ubytek zakazniku kvuli ztrate kvality ze presunuli vyrobu zpet do Cech a zde si celkem bez problemu prosperuji.

budoucnost západní kultury
(stawa, 10. 1. 2012 - 10:21:56)
Odpovědět
Jsem zvědav, jestli přemýšlel nad budoucností "západní kultury" v nynějším systému.

Re: budoucnost západní kultury
(hr, 11. 1. 2012 - 23:19:47)
Odpovědět
Očividně nepřemýšlel nad spoustou věcí. Jestli on tou dlouhou a slavnou tradicí západní hudby (resp. kultury) nemyslel stav, kdy existuje pár hodně slavných a prachatých celebrit v rukou obrovských fabrik a jiní umělci si nemají jak vyskakovat. Tak to chápu, že ho informační věk zaskočil :(


(, 10. 1. 2012 - 10:12:07)
Odpovědět
Pan myslitel by tímto uvažováním by mohl poslat do vězení každého, protože ta jeho vize společnosti stojí myšlence vlastnického práva. Ale nejdřív, aby někdo mohl něco "vlastnit" musel to nejdřív vzít (jako dnes těžaři berou uhlí). A teď se pánové diví, že jim někdo něco "krade"?

:)
(arjuna, 10. 1. 2012 - 10:10:59)
Odpovědět
> Bude-li současný trend globalizace pokračovat, intelektuální vlastnictví bude brzy naším jediným zdrojem příjmu.

Naopak, zanikne prirozenou smrti, protoze zeme tretiho sveta s Cinou v cele toto vlastnictvi neuznavaji.

Existuje jednoducha trojclenka:

svoboda - technologicky pokrok - autorska prava (v soucasnem trendu k jejich prebujelosti)

Vsechny tri cleny zaroven udrzet nelze.

> Domyslíme-li to do konce, znamená to smrt dlouhé slavné tradice západní profesionální hudby.

Sto let dlouhe? Vic tezko.

> Místo vyvádění desátků na Kajmanské ostrovy tak musí například Dopravní podnik hlavního města Prahy odpovídat občanům. Škody, které touto kverulantskou aktivitou vznikají, těžko vyčíslovat.

Aha, tak proto - a ne kvuli predrazenym zakazkam, viz odkaz - je DP tak nehospodarny!

http://www.prvnizpravy.cz/zpravy/sid=hujaajpflfedr542m0h6rjvno4/zpravy/business/pra

Re: :)
(Pavel, 10. 1. 2012 - 11:04:01)
Odpovědět
> > Domyslíme-li to do konce, znamená to smrt dlouhé slavné tradice západní profesionální hudby.

> Sto let dlouhe? Vic tezko.

Tak tady bych trochu let pridal, nebot zapadni hudba ma uz tradici nekolik tisic let :) (ostatne nikdo moc netusi jaka hudba se hrala treba v antice a driv, protoze se proste dochovalo hrozne malo zaznamu).

Spis mozna stoji za zamysleni, jak je mozne, ze hudba (a nesmirne kvalitni) vznikala i v dobe, kdyz zadny kopirovaci monopol neexistoval. A umelci te doby urcite nezivorili.

Re: Re: :)
(Okolojdoucíí, 10. 1. 2012 - 11:23:39)
Odpovědět
Přehlédl jste slůvko "profesionální". Myslím, že pojmem profesionální hudba se naráží na hudbu, která přináší zisk prodejem kopií. Samozřejmě, že živá hudba, jak sám píšete, má mnohatisíciletou tradici, ale nešlo o profesionální hudbu, nýbrž o (nejvýše) profesionální hudebníky.

Co se živoření umělců týče, každý se živil jak dovedl, někteří měli mecenáše, mnozí jiní byli potulní a ve zlatě se rozhodně neváleli. Jistě se o zisk museli přičinit vlastní prací, nikoliv prací lisu na CD. (A to pomíjím fakt, že řada umělců měla umění jako bokovku.)

Re: Re: Re: :)
(Pavel, 10. 1. 2012 - 11:39:32)
Odpovědět
To neni uplne pravda, rada byla profesionalnich skladatelu (zvlast od obdobi renezance, baroka a tak dal), kteri si take treba privydelavali hranim. Samozrejme casto byli podporovani mecenasi, ale na tom neni nic spatneho. A ono treba naprosto klicovy vynalez z pohledu hudby byl vynalez knihtisku, protoze poprve se mohla hudba zacit poradne sirit, dostat se mezi hodne lidi.

Kazdopadne ano, nevaleli se asi v penezich jako nekteri dnesni umelci a mozna to bylo i dobre. Nicmene osobne nemam proti tomu, aby si umelci dneska vydelavali diky technologii vic. Ale spis nez nesmyslnymi monopoly be se meli snazit svoji hudbu propagovat a podporovat cloveka, aby si ji treba koupil. Pokud stazeni kopie mimo monopol je nejjednodussi cesta a zaroven pochopitelne nejlevnejsi, tak je to celkem jednoducha volba pro vetsinu lidi. Proto si myslim, ze zruseni kopirovaciho monopolu by naopak hudebnimu prumyslu prospelo.

Re: Re: Re: Re: :)
(Okolojdoucíí, 10. 1. 2012 - 11:49:33)
Odpovědět
Váš názor je velice rozumný a víceméně se shoduje s tím mým.

Jen nesouhlasím s tím, že se hudba pořádně šířila mezi lidi s vynálezem knihtisku (15. století). Mezi tehdy negramotným lidem (prakticky do začátku 19. století) se hudba šířila především hraním (tedy živým provozováním). A šířila-li se přes hranice států, pak zásluhou potulných hudebníků. Vážná hudba od renesančních skladatelů byla záležitostí vyšší sorty lidí (bohatších měšťanů, šlechty), kterou za lid při nejlepší vůli považovat nelze.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: :)
(Pavel, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:28:00)
Odpovědět
Tady si spatne rozumime tim, co se mysli sireni hudby. Ja jsem tedka prave zacal poslouchat nejake prednasky o historii klasicke hudby: http://www.thegreatcourses.com/tgc/courses/course_detail.aspx?cid=700 (moc vyborne). Proste tim, ze se mohli tisknout noty, tak najednou bylo mozne tu vaznou hudbu poradne sirit mezi skladately nebo treba mezi kostely (ostatne kostely bylo hlavni centrum kultury a i hudby ve stredoveku). Tim se hudba taky zacala mnohem rychleji menit a vyvijet. Treba je i zajimave, ze v techto dobach byla vetsina hudby prevazne zpivana, nastroje se pouzivali pouze hodne zridka.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: :)
(Okolojdoucíí, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:33:22)
Odpovědět
Děkuji za zajímavý postřeh s kostely, to mne nenapadlo.

QigOAWDdubw
(Tori, 26. 1. 2012 - 13:43:12)
Odpovědět
Thanks for the great info dog I owe you bgigity.

esFUymcLgSM
(jmpbnwlssaz, 26. 1. 2012 - 17:08:37)
Odpovědět
ZReCYV zxmqkgnzmwdj

Re: Re: Re: Re: :)
(arjuna, 10. 1. 2012 - 14:17:46)
Odpovědět
> To neni uplne pravda, rada byla profesionalnich skladatelu (zvlast od obdobi renezance, baroka a tak dal), kteri si take treba privydelavali hranim. Samozrejme casto byli podporovani mecenasi, ale na tom neni nic spatneho.

Na mecenasich prakticky stala cela vazna hudba v novoveku. Skladatele vetsinou skladali na objednavku pro cirkevni sbory a slechtu a vedle koncertu si casto privydelavali jako ucitele hudby. To se tykalo i tak spickovych jako Mozart nebo Bach.

Re: Re: Re: :)
(hugo dugo, 10. 1. 2012 - 12:52:39)
Odpovědět
profesionálni hudobníci predsa môžu byť aj koncertní
fakt, že hudba existuje niekoľko tisíc rokov, a hudobné nosiče sa masovo predávajú necelých sto rokov
tu by som dodal, že na toto mali svojho času ťažké srdce baroví hudobníci, pretože gramoplatne a rádiá (právom) brali ako likvidačnú konkurenciu:)

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(next_ghost, 10. 1. 2012 - 15:40:39)
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Ta slavná tradice západní profesionální hudby před rokem oslavila teprve padesáté výročí. Konkrétně výročí schválení Římské úmluvy úmluvy o autorském právu, jejímž přijetím nahrávací průmysl povýšil z bezvýznamných poskoků na vládce mediálního světa.

Podrobnosti: http://falkvinge.net/2011/02/16/history-of-copyright-part-6-hijacked-by-record-industry/

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(Hayden, 25. 9. 2016 - 11:52:17)
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(Casey, 25. 9. 2016 - 16:03:48)
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(Lonnie, 25. 9. 2016 - 16:03:51)
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(Madison, 25. 9. 2016 - 16:03:52)
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Jestli pak Kuras četl program ČPS ?
(petrib, 10. 1. 2012 - 09:24:15)
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Tipl bych si, že ne a že to opět psal podle toho co někde zaslechl v hospodě.
Neznáte náhodou někdo email na Kurase? Nedohledal jsem ho a kromě úvodní otázky jsem mu chtěl poslat následující vitp:
Znáte ten, jak stařík musel zaplatit pokutu za pálení slivovice načerno – a když se ohradil, že nepálí, orgán s neochvějnou logikou kontruje: „Ale máte přístroj.“ Stařík na to, aby si tedy připsali i znásilnění. „Vy jste někoho znásilnil?“ „To sice ne, ale přístroj mám.“

Re: Jestli pak Kuras četl program ČPS ?
(irokez, 10. 1. 2012 - 20:39:38)
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email na Kurase: emailu benkuras@seznam.cz

http://blog.aktualne.centrum.cz/blogy/benjamin-kuras.php?itemid=3754

Ha Ha Ha
(Spirit, 10. 1. 2012 - 09:00:39)
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Článek by měl být v rubrice Hogo Fogo. Jinak super.
BTW jestli pak víte, že krátce po založení strany Svobodných počastoval Klaus pana Kurase, že zpackal pravicovou politiku na 5 let dopředu. Kdepak asi pan Kuras dělá chybu? :D


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